Author Topic: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge  (Read 389 times)

MarkB

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Another case of shooting when you shouldn't.  The BG was fleeing the scene when he was shot by the CCW carrier.  from Fox News.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/nebraska-woman-with-concealed-carry-permit-arrested-on-assault-charge-after-shooting-fleeing-shoplifting-suspect
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Clarence

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2019, 11:50:08 AM »
Nebraska requires training.  Just shows that you cannot instil common sense. 
Never bring a gun into the situation unless it is life threatening.   

I would hope if this really is the way it played out that a very serious sentence is handed down. 
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Just Bill

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2019, 12:39:30 PM »
Shoplifting is not exactly a life threatening crime, unless the perp was armed.  I might consider drawing on them as a warning, but not worth shooting.  As in stop, halt you genius!!

It sounds like she was a good shot, however.  I only skimmed the article, where was he shot??  If in the back, there is no defense on her part.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2019, 12:41:42 PM by Just Bill »
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Clarence

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2019, 02:03:11 PM »
Shoplifting is not exactly a life threatening crime, unless the perp was armed.  I might consider drawing on them as a warning, but not worth shooting.  As in stop, halt you genius!!

It sounds like she was a good shot, however.  I only skimmed the article, where was he shot??  If in the back, there is no defense on her part.
I would not draw on a shoplifter especially as a bystander. An aggressive prosecutor will file an assault or brandishing charge. 

Do not bring a gun into the situation unless to defend life, limb or maidenhead.
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navitimer806

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2019, 03:21:23 PM »
Shoplifting is not exactly a life threatening crime, unless the perp was armed.  I might consider drawing on them as a warning, but not worth shooting.  As in stop, halt you genius!!

It sounds like she was a good shot, however.  I only skimmed the article, where was he shot??  If in the back, there is no defense on her part.
Emphasizes the need for persons holding a CCDW to know the legal elements required to employ an affirmative claim of self-defense. Drawing a weapon satisfies the requirement for assault in most states and subjects you to deadly force  used against you as you now meet one of the 5 requirements - you are now an imminent threat.
The five elements:
1. innocence
2. imminence
3. proportionality
4. avoidance
5. reasonableness

the avoidance element is not required in so called stand your ground states. All elements have to be present to justify self defense.

NormH3

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2019, 07:02:51 PM »
Shoplifting is not exactly a life threatening crime, unless the perp was armed.  I might consider drawing on them as a warning, but not worth shooting.  As in stop, halt you genius!!

It sounds like she was a good shot, however.  I only skimmed the article, where was he shot??  If in the back, there is no defense on her part.
She hit him in the arm but not before the store worker had run out the door as well in chase. I agree with others here. The gun should have remained holstered or at least reholstered after the BG left the store. She is in deep doo doo and will most likely lose her ability to legally carry.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2019, 07:04:33 PM by NormH3 »

Cbmarine

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2019, 08:47:47 PM »
Shoplifting is not exactly a life threatening crime, unless the perp was armed.  I might consider drawing on them as a warning, but not worth shooting.  As in stop, halt you genius!!

It sounds like she was a good shot, however.  I only skimmed the article, where was he shot??  If in the back, there is no defense on her part.
Emphasizes the need for persons holding a CCDW to know the legal elements required to employ an affirmative claim of self-defense. Drawing a weapon satisfies the requirement for assault in most states and subjects you to deadly force  used against you as you now meet one of the 5 requirements - you are now an imminent threat.

The five elements:
1. innocence
2. imminence
3. proportionality
4. avoidance
5. reasonableness

the avoidance element is not required in so called stand your ground states. All elements have to be present to justify self defense.
A slightly different look at 4 of the 5 elements above (innocence excluded) is AOJ+P. Does the BG have the Ability and Opportunity to cause serious harm and are you in Jeopardy plus are you are able to Preclude (avoid, de-escalate) the imminent threat?
The shooter was not in AOJ at the trigger pull instant. Ergo deep doo-doo.

Andrew Branca, who contributed to a thread on George Zimmerman as his trial was underway, has written an excellent book called The Law of Self Defense in which the chapters 2-5 discuss @navitimer806ís five points above (in that order) in detail.  Are we reading the same books or is there something more?
« Last Edit: August 31, 2019, 11:51:57 PM by Cbmarine »
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navitimer806

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Re: Nebraska woman with concealed-carry permit arrested on assault charge
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2019, 03:53:50 PM »
CBmarine
We are reading from the same book as well as books by Masaad Ayoob. Eye-opening perspectives on self-defense law.